Topic: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Hi all,

New user here, hello. Posting about my experience setting up Pianoteq Pro with Roland LX-17.

This piano has 6 amplifiers and 8 speakers, notably a pair in front of the keyboard, which makes quite a difference even with respect to Roland LX-7. It also has Supernatural model unlimited voices internal model, so it is interesting to compare against Pianoteq that I still felt would bring further advantages, so I went ahead and bought that as well.

Connectivity-wise, I am sending the Piano MIDI output over a USB cable to a Macbook Pro 15" (late 2014 model). I also send the output from the headphones (line out) jack back to the (same) piano. I set MIDI control to off in the Roland settings and can flip back and forth between the internal and the Pianoteq sound with just one press of the + or - buttons, which is great for AB comparisons.

In terms of latency--I cannot detect any delay at all, for example at 128 deep buffer. Equally, I cannot hear any crackling sound.

In terms of sound: the above setup provides a very rich and satisfying sound, comparable to the internal sound. However, this required some tweaks that I want to report here. I use the 96 kHz internal sample rate, and my first question is why is the 192 kHz option not available, even though I have a Pro version?

Also, I do not understand why the velocity curves are published here without also specifying the output and dynamics settings. Currently, I have the following settings:

Velocity = [0, 8, 18, 31, 50, 71, 98, 127; 0, 11, 27, 50, 76, 100, 121, 127]
Volume: -2db
Dynamics: 55db

I built the velocity table manually, ensuring that I have roughly the same dynamics as with the internal sound. I have found that the MIDI signal never really goes above 100, so the above velocity curve has to approach the fff level around that velocity. The sound meter goes to amber if I hit the keys hard. I can also play ppp with very light touch.

I run Roland at 55 volume to make it sound not excessively loud.

I am using the Stereophonic output, is that what is expected for playing without headphones?

One final unrelated observation: Bluetooth on this piano is very good for connecting to iPad--everything works well with no delays. Apps like Piano adventures play-along can both follow the keys pressed and play the accompaniment back to the piano at the same time, with no perceived delays. I am still exploring many apps available, and am particularly on the lookout for those supporting Bluetoooth connection to the piano. What is your experience and recommendations?

Thanks!

Last edited by Torero (05-02-2018 10:48)

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Hi Torero,

I'm also using Pianoteq with my Roland LX-7 but mainly with headphones.
When I use Roland acoustic system with Pianoteq it sounds different. The sound goes from the bottom and I don't hear the top speakers.
I use miniJack input in DP.

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Andrey wrote:

Hi Torero,

I'm also using Pianoteq with my Roland LX-7 but mainly with headphones.
When I use Roland acoustic system with Pianoteq it sounds different. The sound goes from the bottom and I don't hear the top speakers.
I use miniJack input in DP.

Understood, perhaps something to investigate further, although note that LX-7 does not actually have the pair of speakers I was referring to _above_ the keyboard. It is noted in the reviews and was one of the reasons I went for a more expensive (bad for the wallet) option.

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Torero wrote:

Connectivity-wise, I am sending the Piano MIDI output over a USB cable to a Macbook Pro 15" (late 2014 model).

I use the 96 kHz internal sample rate, and my first question is why is the 192 kHz option not available, even though I have a Pro version?

I use a 2013 Mac Pro and Apple's Core Audio restricts the sampling rate to 96 kHz whatever the capacity of the DAC. 96 kHz is overkill anyway for pianoteq, better use 48 kHz you won't lose anything.

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Gilles wrote:
Torero wrote:

Connectivity-wise, I am sending the Piano MIDI output over a USB cable to a Macbook Pro 15" (late 2014 model).

I use the 96 kHz internal sample rate, and my first question is why is the 192 kHz option not available, even though I have a Pro version?

I use a 2013 Mac Pro and Apple's Core Audio restricts the sampling rate to 96 kHz whatever the capacity of the DAC. 96 kHz is overkill anyway for pianoteq, better use 48 kHz you won't lose anything.

Yes, thanks, you are likely correct about the headphone jack. For the USB out, I have an Ayre QB-9 DSD DAC that happily accepts 192 kHz from Audirvana over USB.

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Torero wrote:
Andrey wrote:

Hi Torero,

I'm also using Pianoteq with my Roland LX-7 but mainly with headphones.
When I use Roland acoustic system with Pianoteq it sounds different. The sound goes from the bottom and I don't hear the top speakers.
I use miniJack input in DP.

Understood, perhaps something to investigate further, although note that LX-7 does not actually have the pair of speakers I was referring to _above_ the keyboard. It is noted in the reviews and was one of the reasons I went for a more expensive (bad for the wallet) option.

Hi Torero,

What is your key touch settings on Roland?

Last edited by Andrey (20-03-2018 14:53)

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

Andrey wrote:
Torero wrote:
Andrey wrote:

Hi Torero,

I'm also using Pianoteq with my Roland LX-7 but mainly with headphones.
When I use Roland acoustic system with Pianoteq it sounds different. The sound goes from the bottom and I don't hear the top speakers.
I use miniJack input in DP.

Understood, perhaps something to investigate further, although note that LX-7 does not actually have the pair of speakers I was referring to _above_ the keyboard. It is noted in the reviews and was one of the reasons I went for a more expensive (bad for the wallet) option.

Hi Torero,

What is your key touch settings on Roland?

Hi Andrey,

I have kept everything on defaults so far on the piano itself. So happy with this piano upgrade and also use Pianoteq occasionally for some special experience--otherwise, just happy to progress with my playing.

Cheers

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

I received a request from 4michael1 to post some further info on private message: I'm replying here instead.

1. How are you using it?

I am connected via a USB cable to my laptop, which is a Macbook Pro 15 late 2013 model. Pianoteq recognises LX-17 as a MIDI controller. I generally reduce the latency to the smallest safe value. I have played with the velocity curve and it generally curves upward and I can see, for some reason, that the very high levels are clipped.

I then run a return headphone cable from the headphone jack on the Macbook back to LX-17 where there is an extra input. I make sure to first plug it into the Macbook end and only after that into the piano--otherwise, there is considerable microphone hum occurring.

I then set the MIDI to External control--it is close to the end of the settings list. It is easy to swap between internal and external control back and forth with +/- buttons on LX-17--so I can compare quickly what I am playing.

By the way, the above setup allows any sound to go to the LX-17. Some of the sounds can be a little 'scary', for example, Skype call tone resonates like crazy at high volumes.

Now, it goes without saying I can use plugins such as synthesizers on LX-17 in this way. I actually have a Roland subscription and can get some really impressive sound through LX-17.

2. Sound of Steinway D through the LX-17 speaker system...does it sound as amazing?

I do not know about amazing, but with proper use of volume and velocity, I can volume match it against the internal sound and the Pianoteq sound is very satisfying. I like the base lines in particular--where the internal engine is smooth as silk, but Model D is full of character. I suppose all the main PQ pianos like Bluethner sound very impressive and real.

I have one problem: I need to explore it further so cannot yet validate it fully. The problem is with really fast play like trills. I could do some recordings to validate what I am feeling, but I have a sense of things slowing down somewhat. I am not sure how this happens with such incredibly small latency but I am feeling some sort of delay--again it is not confirmed, I am not sure it is there, I can measure how it actually work etc--but I have to mention it.

Comparing the LX-17 sound with headphones is simply beyond comparison to me. OK, I do not own some really exceptional headphones, just a Philips pair that is just over 120 dollars worth, so I cannot predict how it sounds with those costing 3000, but with LX-17, it does sound, let us find a word: glorious.

Given that I am just an amateur with a keen ear and heaps of desire to learn, I find myself lately playing with the internal sound but I love how I can switch to Steinways or Bluethner (haven't played much Grotrian, and see for myself what it should be like on those very different instruments. Even that alone is incredible to me and worth the purchase of PQ.

So to confirm, to my ears the sound system in LX-17 is exceptional--and I have access to really high-end stereo setup to compare against, and even with my very limited ability, I can almost sound like very good piano recordings in simple passages.

Thanks

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

@ Torero

thanks so much for taking the time to give me such a thoughtful and detailed reply, i'll follow your setup
my LX-17 just arrived today and i can't wait to try the Steinway D through these incredible speakers!
cheers!
michael

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

A further clarification for 4michael1. In order to enable the external Line In to control the sound of this piano, you need to

1. get to the menu by pressing Ambiance and Brilliance simultaneously.
2. scroll right using the > key on the right to Function 25/33 called "Local Control". After the piano boots up, this setting is always set to "On".
3. Use the "-" button to change it to read "Local Control" Off (you can re-enable the internal sounds using the + "button").

Also, double check that the headphone cable from the Headphone output of your PC/Mac goes into Line In of the piano, and further check that the PC/Mac use the headphone output for playing sounds--you can further check this by connecting your headphone cable from PC/Mac to actual headphones and if that works, plug it into the piano--the correct socket on the piano is simply labelled "Input".

Last edited by Torero (28-04-2018 10:04)

Re: Roland LX-17 digital piano: experience setting up Pianoteq

thanks Torero!
that worked
Pianoteq doesn't have the same rich sound, to my ears, coming through the main speakers of the LX-17 as it does though the headphones
a little disappointing, but to be expected i guess
maybe with some tweaking
thanks again for your help,
michael