Topic: Piano tuner verified?

Hello,

I am new to the forum, and a new Pianoteq owner.

Pianoteq is a unique product to be sure, and there are lots of settings to tweak! Maybe too many (or maybe not enough), but it is fun.

I used to tune pianos, and I have noticed something that bugs me...it seems like 6ths (especially in the middle C range) are 'off' somehow. Maybe they are too perfect, so it just sounds odd to my ears.

Has anyone at Pianoteq verified that the interval oscillations are appropriate, possibly with a piano tuner? You probably have, but I thought I would ask. Maybe I just need to take a break...

Other than that, I have been trying to make a preset that sounds like my PC2x,which I am discovering is not going to work. This is more like a real piano, and I am even playing it differently because of this. However, it does sound a little 'thin' compared to my PC2x.

A little more EQ should do it!

:-)



One feature I would like to see is layering, but from within the engine so it can be done more efficiently. I know I can just instantiate another Pianoteq, but that would have double the computations for resonance, etc. I would like to add more character to the sound...thicken it up. I would also like to layer/split different sounds and tunings for obvious reasons. Know what I mean?


Thank you,
JR

Re: Piano tuner verified?

johnrule wrote:

... I have been trying to make a preset that sounds like my PC2x,which I am discovering is not going to work. This is more like a real piano, and I am even playing it differently because of this. However, it does sound a little 'thin' compared to my PC2x....I would like to add more character to the sound...thicken it up. I would also like to layer/split different sounds and tunings for obvious reasons....

I'm assuming you are talking about Kurzweil ?  I definitely get more goose bumps when I layer my Kurzweil PC2 piano with Pianoteq.  When you listen to the extreme bass notes side by side, the Kurzweil has a timbre that sits lower in its own space, and so the layering doesn't seem to introduce any chorusing but rather fattens up the notes quite dramatically.  I'm not a purist when it comes to the sound I'm after, I just want a sound that inspires me.  If I was on a deserted island (with plenty of solar power) and had to choose only one, I'd pick Pianoteq.  It's interesting to hear how differently we all hear things...  It's a bit like color -we don't really see the same colors, we just give the same name to the colors on the same surfaces....

"Downing a fifth results in diminished capacity."

Re: Piano tuner verified?

When you say that the sixths seem off, do you mean that when you play the tonic and the sixth of any scale together, they sound off? Or do you mean full sixth chords?

Re: Piano tuner verified?

johnrule wrote:

I used to tune pianos, and I have noticed something that bugs me...it seems like 6ths (especially in the middle C range) are 'off' somehow. Maybe they are too perfect, so it just sounds odd to my ears.

Has anyone at Pianoteq verified that the interval oscillations are appropriate, possibly with a piano tuner? You probably have, but I thought I would ask. Maybe I just need to take a break...

I just needed a break!

I think the Bosendorfer_290.fxp that was uploaded here on this forum should be part of the demo. I was not all that impressed with the built-in presets, but now I am! I was also able to tweak things just the way I like...this thing is astonishingly tweakable  :-)

JR

Re: Piano tuner verified?

Jake Johnson wrote:

When you say that the sixths seem off, do you mean that when you play the tonic and the sixth of any scale together, they sound off? Or do you mean full sixth chords?

The tonic and the sixth of any scale together...

I have been playing a song that has a very open structure at certain parts (just the root in the bass, and 6ths in the right hand) on my Kurzweil PC2x for several years. The first time I played that song on my Pianoteq, it just sounded out of tune when I played that interval.

As I started troubleshooting (albeit at about 1 am) I thought it was possible that the interval was not oscillating right, and might be off somehow. After a good nights rest, things sound alright now...just not the same as the PC2x, that's all.


Thanks,
JR

Re: Piano tuner verified?

I still want to know more. Did you have some parameters shifted so that the sixths sounded bad?

Regardless, can you take ten minutes to post an mp3 of your keyboard playing your ROM sixths, sustained, and Pianoteq playing the same sixths at the same velocities in the Files section? (You might just create a midi file and save a recording of both instruments playing it.)

Even if you now hear them both as being good, but different, it can't hurt to let us all hear both instruments playing the tonic and 6th together. I'm just curious, really. I'd like to hear how the two instruments sound side by side.

Re: Piano tuner verified?

Jake Johnson wrote:

I still want to know more. Did you have some parameters shifted so that the sixths sounded bad?

Regardless, can you take ten minutes to post an mp3 of your keyboard playing your ROM sixths, sustained, and Pianoteq playing the same sixths at the same velocities in the Files section? (You might just create a midi file and save a recording of both instruments playing it.)

Even if you now hear them both as being good, but different, it can't hurt to let us all hear both instruments playing the tonic and 6th together. I'm just curious, really. I'd like to hear how the two instruments sound side by side.

You can easily check this yourself by selecting a patch like 'Grand C2 Warm', and playing the G to E 6th above middle C. Notice how this interval oscillates rather than 'rings'. Don't believe me? Move up one whole step to the A to F 6th. Move back and forth to hear the difference...

It's not that bad, really, but these ears noticed it. I can live with it.

JR

Re: Piano tuner verified?

If you have s(M)exoscope installed you can 'see' what I am hearing  ;-)

JR