Bb1 is making an usual sound

Is it possible that your controller developed a problem and sends a significantly higher velocity o  that key?
Maybe check with other vsts too, or use a generated midi file in pianoteq with a scale played at the same velocity for every note and see if the problem persists.

It was worth excluding that hypothesis

Hello All,

Both notes B-Flat 1 and B Natural 1 have this overtone present when the note is struck with high note-on velocity.  The feature is clearly not there at note A1.  I confirm this sound is present on the rest of the Steinway D presets.

So, "What is it?"
I hear the sonic artifact as a high A-flat sounding as Ab5 when note Bb1 is struck hard.  The interval of a Seventh, sounding some four octaves higher than the fundamental tone, suggests this is an accentuation of the Seventh Harmonic. This is why piano designers usually design, or scale the strike point (at least in the lowest octaves) to hit the string at the node measuring approximately one-seventh of the way along the string -- so as to "avoid" the very sonic artifact that is being heard here.  Opinions vary from manufacturer to manufacturer regarding scaling the strike to hit as close to 1/7th in lower strings, but this is not always possible to execute in real life, either.

I tried downwardly adjusting the 7th harmonic in the first page, but to no avail.  This characteristic seems to be inherent in Modartt's emulation of the Steinway Model D piano.  As of this writing, I did not go into Pianoteq PRO's editing window to modify the strike point only of these two notes. 

Hope this helps,

Cheers,

Joe

EDIT:
For sake of completeness in this argument, when one strikes the adjacent B1, the artifact also sounds a semitone higher (at A5).  Ironically, the artifact is contained in only these two notes:  When C2 is struck hard, its closest overtone is ALSO heard as note A5 instead of A#5.  Interesting. 
End Edit.

Hello Steve,

As a piano tech, my only recourse would be to modify the shape and hardness of the offending hammer.  (But I almost know ahead of time this will not correct the problem.) Why?  That's because I can NOT modify the length of the given bass string in a real acoustic grand piano; I am not in a position to change strings (because a new one would have to be ordered, and its speaking length would still be the same -- and it would be musical suicide to guess an alternate string composition or mass that would be any better); I can NOT vary the strike point along a single string to any extent that would modify the overtone.

In the specific case of note Bb1, there is an outside possibility the is a two-string note, in which case I might try blocking off the most offending string of the two, and working with the other string to tame the offending overtone; but then the volume of the remaining string might be insufficient to carry the tone for two strings. 

Although I do not recommend what I am about to say:  One might try modifying the strike of the hammer such that it only hits the less-offending string (in a two-string note Bb1), and rely on sympathetic vibration to excite the offending note, without striking it with the hammer.

Hope this gives some insight.  In reality, if what is being heard occurs on a real grand piano, one must suppose that this is but one of the many compromises a piano designer must live with, when setting the scale of any piano design to meet a given price point.

Cheers,

Joe

P.S.  The one case that might be corrected would be if the offending bass string had a twist in it.  Then, I would have to replace the offending string with a new one of the same specification.  Please note, however, a twisted string might give a different sonic artifact than the offensive overtone you have noted.

To answer your direct question, as a technician ...  Yes, I would want to eliminate this artifact, if I could.

Cheers,

Joe

I agree. Indeed, Pianoteq is revered for its realistic piano modeling but not to sound patronizing but I don't think any piano VST provider would want to advertise being so realistic that a note or two will have a displeasing ring to it just like how real pianos could have. Don't get me wrong though, I am very much enjoying Pianoteq and I look forward to buying other instrument packs but my friendly criticism still stands.

Obviously I can only speak for myself but I'd argue that the majority of Pianoteq users would prefer to not have this piercing sound present in the Steinway instruments. Just like how I'd imagine most wouldn't want to hear it in a real instrument either. Here's hoping that Pianoteq developers can "fix" this sort-of problem without needing Pro.

I assume - maybe naively - that S&S auditioned the Pianoteq version of the D and thought it was close enough to the sound of a particular instrument that was used for the modelling, or what they know the sound of a typical D to be, to allow their name to be used by Modartt. I also believe that most pianists on this forum want to be able to say - to themselves and others -  "without buying a real SteinwayD, this is the nearest at present to what one sounds like." (I respect those who take advantage of the tweaks available to create instruments that cannot exist in hardware form)

Now S&S either provided/allowed a less than average instrument - to keep a software version safely below the sound of their instruments*, but quite close, or the average D does sound like this. I have played Ds in the past, but cannot hold in my memory that level of detail.  If the average D does have this characteristic ex factory, then there must be a way of prepping them for professional concert use. If pianists on the forum are troubled by it, and I assume they are not all first tier concert pianists, then 1st tier concert pianists would also be troubled by it and S&S technicians would fix it.

I personally hear the note in question to be slightly harsher than those nearby, but with similar characteristics and am quite happy to play an instrument that approaches the sound of a D but which may not have been expertly prepped to suit a tier 1 concert pianist. (If that is indeed the case) I can tweak the sound somewhat in any case and do what all pianists do apart from those touring the world's concert venues: adjust my touch for notes that don't quite mesh with their neighbours.

* I worked in the food industry: the quality of all manfacturer's products were kept slightly above the 'private label' versions they also produced for supermarket own label products.

A while back it was pointed out to me that the twanginess that cycles on and off during a long-held note is the audible manifestation of a vibrating string that might have started oscillating with an up-down motion, then precessing to a side-side motion, and then back again.  As one who's plucked a more than a few taut rubber bands in my childhood and seen this happen (and heard it), it makes sense to me a a potential cause for some of this sound 'artifact' (and I hear it on some notes on my real piano).  Philippe, does this hold in Pianoteq?

Philippe,

If you don't mind, I thought it best I mention that the problem I am highlighting is most significant at ff.  At that velocity, Steinway D Bb1 and K2 C2 are dominated by the overtone.  It is almost hard to hear the primary. 

best,
steve

Great point, Phillipe!  Though I feel that this is easier said than done.

In my case I am using a real piano keyboard with a QRS MIDI strip attached.  I should be able to teach it that it's really hard to get to fff, but even on my real piano when the stop bar is left out, there's just only so loud it will play even if I really whack it.

I feel a "Spinal Tapp" moment coming on...:

"When you're really giving it your all, and you just want that 'extra push'...Where do you go?  127....That's why our amplifiers go to 127!"

Just kidding (sort-of!).

A little too "Realistic" ?

Maybe, but the detractors say pianoteq is too "synthetic".

I could argue it either way, i.e.
a) for removal of all the nasty artifacts of wooden pianos wherever possible.
The things that piano designers, builders and technicians would remove if only thy could.

b) Include the "warts and all" of pianos built in traditional ways from traditional materials.
The things that pianoteq detractors usually refer to as "character", incidental mechanical noises are already in.

Compromise is to make them switchable, control to attenuate them down to zero.
OK, so that is in Pro, but I feel it should be in Standard.