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Topic: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

Hi,

I bought yesterday the RCF Art 310a - and pianoteq simply *shines* on it. It weighs around 12kg, and carries 350W.
My previous amp is an ALTO Elvis 10A, which is much heavier and weaker, and I also listened to dB's (italian) in the store. The RCF costs much more than both, but it is definitely worth it.

I'm not an RCF salesman whatsoever!!, just wanted to share my experience - for you guys who are looking for a portable great sound solution for small gigs.

cheers,
Eran

M-Audio Profire 610 / Roland Fp-3 / Reaper / PianoTeq!
www.myspace.com/etalmor

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

Lucky you. I tried Pianoteq together with a new, expensive, Barbetta keyboard amp last night for the first  time, and it was awful. In my experience, all that complexity in the Pianoteq sound--wonderful through headphones-- ends up just sounding murky through an amp. No fun to play. This seems to be a problem with piano sounds in general, but especially pianoteq. I usually end up switching to a basic electric piano sound that doesn't have all those overtones.

Maybe there is some way to tweak the eq to arrive at a sound I could get used to.

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

++Yes, all speakers contribute "murkiness" compared to headphones. Partly this is due to there being an enclosure, and partly to sound from the rear of the drive unit emerging from the enclosure also. Audiophiles speak highly of (mostly DIY) speakers which either have a front only and no sides or back. Or are mounted flush in a brick wall so the rear sound disperses harmlessly somewhere else. Arguable a loudspeaker box is the worst possible solution (even a horn is better in theory wink ).

The other problem is that it is impossible to make a high quality drive unit which covers all frequencies, so it is usual to have at least separate units for the treble and the bass/midrange. To cut costs these are usually all driven by one amplifier (on each channel). This has the effect that the drive units are not only driving the amplifier (back EMF) but driving each other as well. The result is further murkiness to the sound, with loss of dynamic accuracy on both transients and low-level sonic detail.

It is advised to look for (a) active speakers in which each drive unit has its own dedicated amplifier (usually built into the box), (b) evidence of engineering consideration of the problems associated with speaker enclosures - this could be irregular shape, or special materials, or type of construction. Of lesser importance are the quoted average power rating and the maximum sound pressure levels, as most equipment in the "public address" category is designed to reproduce levels greater than that of a piano.

It is not recommended to use the home hi-fi unless it is known to be able to handle high  levels, due to the risk of destroying the high frequency drive units from overload distortion.

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

beansoaker wrote:

Lucky you. I tried Pianoteq together with a new, expensive, Barbetta keyboard amp last night for the first  time, and it was awful. In my experience, all that complexity in the Pianoteq sound--wonderful through headphones-- ends up just sounding murky through an amp. No fun to play. This seems to be a problem with piano sounds in general, but especially pianoteq. I usually end up switching to a basic electric piano sound that doesn't have all those overtones.

Maybe there is some way to tweak the eq to arrive at a sound I could get used to.

I´ve created some presets which I´ve programmed listening to the speakers through which I play live. For me I found out that changing the Overton spec. on pianoteq worked well. The Prestet is on the file list- Bridge_03. But I use a Yamaha Portable Grand for playing Live and You might change the mezzoforte parameters because of diff. velocity settings.
But it still depends on the setting you use. (are you playing classic or do you play with a band?)

Eq-changes might be the last possebility but I don´t like the built in Pianoteq EQ for that. ( It changes sound in a way I wouldn´t expect from an EQ)

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

As you know, listening through headphones or loudspeakers are very different experiences, as in the first case you have the pure sound that comes out from the soundcard, whereas in the second case the reverberation of the room where you are standing is added to this sound. This is why we propose two different outputs in Pianoteq: headphones or loudspeakers. But more important variations on the sound can be obtained by using the other parameters, and you may find it interesting to listen to the following audio demo made by Piet de Ridder, and which demonstrates how air and spacing can be adjusted by combining the internal parameters and reverb unit:
http://www.pianoteq.com/audio/pianoteq-spaces.mp3

An additional remark: when I use loudspeakers, I often increase hammer hardness a little bit to get more brightness.

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

I find playing over good speakers way more enjoyable than the brutally direct experience with headphones.

My favorites (at lower levels, anyway) are AXYS U-14+ (Dutch Product > Duran Audio). They sport a soft dome tweeter and are very dynamic. The softest I have ever heard in live speakers. Most P.A. speakers, including some of expensive brands, are generally way to hard for sensitive playing, especially with piano. This is due to the general purpose (loud) and also because of horn-loaded compression drivers for the treble.

I will check out the RCF for louder levels, thanks for the hint!

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

Does anyone have experience with playing Pianoteq through mainstream keyboard combos, such as those by Roland, Peavey, Laney or Carlsbro?  I am at the point of purchasing a new keyboard combo, and I would value any recommendations. I know that there are some esoteric active cabinet + mixer solutions out there, but I am looking for a single box solution, which would perhaps be capable of stereo playback, through a second speaker. Reproducing piano voicings accurately seems to be a tough challenge.  Years ago I had a Korg sampled Grand Piano (SG1D), and I was never really happy with the way it sounded through P/A's or combos. The Pianoteq is a much more subtle instrument than the SG1D, so I guess it presents even more of a challenge.

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Re: I would like to recommend a great amped speaker for pianoteq

Has Anyone tried playing through a Bose L1? In my opinion the sound reproduction is fantastic, and very capable of cleanly reproducing the slightest nuance. Never tried Pianoteq through it though, but I'd like to.

Last edited by kim (10-11-2007 03:34)

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